We have a very special interview with Jordan Olds, also known as Gwarsenio Hall from his popular YouTube series, ‘Two Minutes to Late Night.’ He is now recognised as Blood Vulture. His new album, titled ‘Die Close,’ is currently available on Pure Noise. Jordan, welcome to Devolution Magazine!
Yeah, great to meet you.
Your new album, Die Close, has a lot of startling things about it, but the more we read into it, there’s a vampiric narrative going on here. Can you tell me about this chap called the Master?
Yeah, there’s a vampiric narrative. I wrote the album while reading Dracula for the first time. And I feel like I was more inspired by the language of Dracula. Like the language, every sentence of the book has people with varied opinions on the quality of the book, but every sentence of the book is kind of inarguably very beautiful. And I feel like the language of it really infected the way that I was writing a lot of the lyrics for the album. And I think it’s naturally based on the existential pondering that I was doing while writing the songs, it naturally just kind of made it vampiric. So, it leaned into it. I think this whole project has been me trying not to stop anything. Like if something went in a direction, I just kind of let it happen.
So, is this vampiric narrative a cool analogy for being a musician? A sort of reclusive lifestyle, also a good analogy for the music industry, which can be kind of vampiric as well, is that just something we’re taking away, or is that something you were conscious of?
I think the way that I used vampirism for the music is just that I kind of found my own interpretation of it, or the way that I could relate. The whole process of this becoming a vampire band has been me finding my way to relate to it. And for me, I was mostly fascinated with the reclusive nature of it, the loneliness of it, the being alive forever of it all and really what that kind of means. And I think that I probably subconsciously, like at least for my experience, half of the lifespan of Two Minutes to Late Night was me recording music and performing alone in a room. So, I guess for my experience in the music industry, yeah. It does tie into that. And so, I feel like I’ve been trying to make vampiric themes apply to me because I’m not, I feel like, at least right now, that I don’t have the traditional appearance of a vampire band performer or whatever. I’m not six, eight. I don’t yet have long flowing hair or anything.
You’re not Pete Steele.
I’m not Pete. I’m not gonna pose for Playboy. I feel like the album became a vampire album. And I was like, all right, this is feeling right to me. So now I have to find a way to make all of this make sense to me, and it really took a lot of digging to figure out what I do to relate to it.
Is the darkness of this project intentionally the opposite of your comedic side?
I didn’t intend to write, I didn’t intend to consciously be like, I’m gonna do something that is dark outside of it. I feel it just kind of happened. And I think that it might’ve been unconsciously that I was trying to, I needed to do something different. Because it had been years, and I don’t know when I started doing Two Minutes, that was my comedic outlet for a long time, and then it transformed into more of a musical outlet. Then I needed to do my own thing. I feel with the comedy portion, I used to be a standup, I felt at a certain point I realised, as the years went on, I don’t know if I have a lot more to say in this space. I’m a cis white guy, my experience is not dissimilar, and it’s been years of that. So, I transformed it into the Two Minutes Conan aspect of things. I feel like I got a lot of that out. And so, I feel like it was time for me to try to do music that was my own, and if I was gonna do it, then I really didn’t wanna do it with anything that could be perceived as like a defence or anything. So, it is the most sincere thing I’ve ever done. It’s campy, but it’s not funny. I mean, I always say the best records are the ones you write for yourself, and if everybody else gets on board, then that’s why, because you wrote it for yourself. You wrote what you wanted to hear.
Staying with that, the sound of the record is what we imagine Alice in Chains or Soundgarden would sound like with a deep knowledge of massively down-tuned guitars and death metal, but it sounds remarkably natural and cohesive. These bedfellows actually work so well together. Did that sound just evolve naturally from what you like and dislike?
So that aspect of it was the original goal that I was trying to achieve. I remember writing some riffs on a regular six-string guitar, and I was feeling a little uninspired. Then, for the first time, I was able to try a seven-string guitar for the first time in my entire life. And I had avoided them forever, mostly for comedic purposes, I grew up with them being associated with deathcore and stuff that I wasn’t really participating in. I’m like, “Oh, that’s not a tool for me.” And then I tried one and I realised, oh, if I play what I like on it, it’s cool. I’m able to achieve these low tunings, but I have all of my high notes. So, the project really kind of came out of me having this new tool, realising that you can just play Crowbar on a 7-string. Then I was thinking about how there are a lot of bands that have tried to do the Alice in Chains thing, and it doesn’t work. There’s a lot, like every copycat of them that I’m not interested in, and I really thought about why, and it’s because when you take away their darkness and their heaviness that they were trying to achieve, they never really saw themselves as a regular rock band. They were trying to be Black Sabbath. When you take that aspect away from them, you just have butt rock and stuff. So, I was like, what would be the next evolution for that? And I was like, oh, I wonder if you could take Alice in Chains’ style, their approach to melody and harmony and place it over really intense, chromatic, and dissonant parts in death metal or black metal. See if you could fit all of that together. Like the heavy, the riffs are really pummelling, but there are still hooks and stuff. So that’s kind of where it was initially, trying to combine those sounds. That was the idea.
This seems to be a common thread when we speak to musicians from New York, because we spoke to Imperial Triumphant a little while back. Incredible bands who just have these maverick ideas of, let’s just try this. And let’s just draw from our surroundings. Do you think New York seeps into your music, too, the metropolitan nature of the place?
I think the entirety of New York State seeps into it because it’s like this, there’s so much, I think the history and the age of it and the different architecture. I feel like Imperial Triumphant is so inspired by the 20s, 30s, and 40s of New York. And I feel like I am from 1800s New York. Or before, you know? You can see so much of the promo material and so many pieces of the media that I’ve used for Blood Vulture are based around really old Hudson Valley landmarks. So, just like old Victorian, I filmed at crazy graveyards, crazy old Victorian houses, like I really want to use that. That’s the surroundings that I want to use. I’ve been journeying away from the city and trying to see older pieces of the state. Also, it’s really funny that you bring up Imperial Triumphant because Zach sometimes plays in my live band.
It was Zach we were talking to. What a cool guy!
Yeah, Zach is great. He’s an unbelievable guitar player. My live band is kind of a rotating cassette of my friends who are available. So, when Zach is around, we’re rocking. He’s incredible.
That was our next question, actually, is this going to be a band that tours?
Yes, I think there’s going to be tours, but I’m keeping it kind of open. I’m open to, like, if a lineup really locks in, it being a main lineup, but I also know that it’s a different world out there. I think that everybody’s got a lot of projects right now. Everybody’s got at least two jobs. So not everybody can do every tour. I think that to allow myself the best opportunities, and also just like not make the project feel like a burden to anybody, it’s just when anyone can kind of do it. I also think that that’s kind of the fun part of it, every time you might see Blood Vulture, you’ll see the stuff performed with different musicians. Sometimes it’ll be like, “Oh, it’s cool, there’s Zach from Imperial Triumphant up there!” and there might be some other people that you might recognise in the future.
While we’re talking about friends and other Bands, this album has guest features from Jade Puget of AFI. We’re giant AFI fans mainly for the guitars because they’ve got a wonderful sound all of their own, which we don’t think he gets enough credit for. So, how did that come about?
Well, you know, everything that you said, I agree with. AFI probably was the band that, and Jade specifically, inspired my playing and songwriting. I think that they were the first band to get me into goth punk and even hardcore culture. They’re my way in. The Leaving Song video, this is the first time I was like, “what’s going on here, what is this type of dancing? This is crazy!”. So, actually, when I was in early high school, I grabbed a black Les Paul studio because that’s what Jade played. I think that that’s kind of a key thing, that he was playing a Les Paul studio at that time was pretty nuts because every single other band that you’d see playing, if they’re playing a Gibson, they’re playing a $3,000. Everyone’s playing Les Paul Customs, you know anything else on MTV I would see is like these are high-end ESPs These are high-end Gibsons that are unaffordable and here’s a guy playing like an $800 guitar or less if you get it used so I always thought that that was awesome and genuinely punk, and I still have my Les Paul of his. I’ve remained an AFI fan, and for the anniversary of Sing the Sorrow,
I think it was like the 20th anniversary or something, on Two Minutes with Bo and Colin from Hard Lore and Seb from the band Regulate, who are incredible. We did a cover- slash- tribute called The Leaving Song Part Three. So essentially, the basic way to explain it is it’s the Leaving Song Part One, if it sounded like the Leaving Song Part Two, and it was just them combined, it was just essentially a celebration of AFI, and we had had Hunter on the show previously, and Jade shared the Leaving Song cover. Then he and I began talking about doing maybe some Two Minute stuff, and that just kind of turned into there being a window for me to maybe ask him to be on a track. I knew that when I arranged the song, that little solo section was a perfect spot for someone else to take the lead. Because with me doing vocals, it’s a real fun back-and-forth kind of thing, and I thought of Jade. Grey Mourning is the song that he’s on, and it is the most abrasive, fast, like I would say the closest to a real death metal song that’s on the album. I thought it would be a really fun juxtaposition to have his style of playing in that spot. In my mind, it’s the most interesting. And as far as I know, he has not done a guest solo. I did light research; I could be wrong. There’s not a prominent, “this is Jade Puget doing a guest guitar solo.” I thought it would be fun to put him on, to give him that opportunity and then also to put him on such an out-of-the-box song choice. And his melodic and unique playing style, I think, fits the chaos of that specific section. I think it’s so awesome, and it was, it’s a cool full circle moment to have him on a first record. I feel like there are more famous guitar players or whatever, but there’s not really one that’s definitely unexpected.
So, we go from that guest to Brian Fair from Shadows Fall. Is he a Two Minutes To Late night guest? Because we think he did one of those, didn’t he?
Yeah, he did a Starkweather cover. I’m a huge Brian fan, I love Shadows Fall, and I really love Overcast, his first band. If you don’t know Overcast, it’s kind of like a pre-supergroup of Shadows Fall and Killswitch Engage. They’re one of the five to ten bands that people credit with inventing metalcore or whatever. I remember hearing about them on some kind of MTV2 documentary when I was in high school, or there was some kind of something where everyone was talking about Overcast. I really got into them around then, and I feel like they are forever an underrated hardcore band. They’re so strange, so intense. His voice specifically on those early recordings sounds so crazy. He has this magic of like he always sounds like there are two people screaming, even though it’s just him. It always sounds doubled, just like chopped in two, it’s high and low. I don’t know what’s going on. He’s nuts. He’s also just incredibly cool. It’s cool to see a guy who equally represents metal and hardcore at the same time because that’s what I really want to see from the whole community. It feels like sometimes people are like, “Oh, I can only be into hardcore, or I can only be into metal.” I’m like, “you can like both at the same time, man.” It’s awesome to see him doing Shadow’s Fall stuff.
Then I was at New England Metal and Hardcore last year and just watching him mosh for everybody, still stage diving, still grabbing the mic, I mean this is a real motherfucker right here! I feel like this song in particular is a juxtaposition, because this is the poppiest, most accessible song on the record. The way that this song kind of came together was pretty strange. If you listen to that riff, I was originally thinking of it in a Godflesh mindset. If you hear the section that Brian’s on in the song, it sounds like Godflesh, and that’s originally what the song was supposed to sound like, that section. Then, while fiddling with it, I’m like, “it’s kind of fun if you put like a White Zombie Dragula beat behind it. It kind of turns into a Lady Gaga song a little bit. It’s a big example of like, I’m not gonna stop what this is turning into. Really catchy, and I also think it’s fun to put someone like Brian on that, on the poppy song.
Then the swerve comes again because you’ve got Kristen Hayter on it, for our readers who don’t know, previously known as Lingua Ignota. That’s such a surprising artist to have on the record, especially if you’ve heard some of the recent music she’s released. So, how did that come about?
Kristen is one of my closest friends. I adore her. I think she’s one of the most prolific musical artists of our generation. I feel like she is just really on another level. I think that in general, she’s probably my favourite singer. So, we became unlikely friends through me being essentially like a heavy metal Mickey Mouse and her being this one-woman opera of channelling pain and trauma. I’ve toured with her, and we’ve worked together on a couple of things. When this song was coming together, I realised that it was another instance where the vocal stylings in the verses feel better as a back and forth. She was my initial pick to do it. It is different from anything that she’s ever done, in that it’s like a rock song, you know? It’s rock, but I knew that she would do an incredible job, and I think she did. I think she’s the special magic to the song, and now I think it’s my favourite on the album. I appreciate her for taking a risk in just singing a rock song with me. To her, that is a risk. That’s a step away from what she normally does. I think it is so important and special. We really need artists who push the boundaries. I feel like I do a very small version of that, where I take elements of music that people already like and try to put them together. Like death metal, a lot of people like death metal, and then like grunge, people also like that. It’s not usually together. Those are still things that people like, like having artists that are exploring how to create a new sound in a whole different space, and that’s what she tries to do.
There’s a lot of emphasis put on the music, but not as much emphasis put on sound. That’s how you get a lot of bands that sound the same. Whereas people like yourself and Kirsten have this idea of creating an atmosphere, creating a sound, creating a whole vibe. You don’t get enough of that these days,
I think that’s why she is. When putting the song together, I was like, “She’s the person, she’s the only person I would really want.” But it was like, it was so not in her wheelhouse that I didn’t know if she would want to do it. But she’s the first and, mentally, I think my only choice, maybe.
It’s so cool to hear that these collaborations are so well thought through. Because whenever we see collaborations on albums, we both know in which genres we’re talking about. There are 10 different collaborations on every album, and it’s for about 10 seconds, and it adds nothing to the song. Whereas your collaborations have been to add to the song, to add a different dimension, enhance the collaboration, am I correct?
I think it always depends, when there are short songs that have features on them in a certain genre, hardcore or whatever, I think it’s a different mindset than what I’m doing. Like in a hardcore song, you have your friend, usually, they’re having like a genuine close friend sing on the song with them, because it means something to the band to have your friend on the song. And whether it’s like, yeah, the singer could have just probably done that part also. But I understand it. With me putting Jade on, I’m looking at my song, like, what do I want? What performance here would mean the most to me, and also be the most interesting for the song? That’s how I picked these three artists that are just not normally thought of, I feel like they’re so out of left field, like when you read those names in a row, they’re from completely different worlds. They are all from spaces of music that make up me and what I’m interested in. So, I think I made my feature choices selfishly.
Thank you so much for talking to us today. You’ve been very generous with your time, and hopefully, we’ll see you live at some point.
Take care. Peace
Interview by George Miller